he is Michael Joseph jackson

[Shout]

I've posted this before, the whole Joe/Joseph issue is irrelevant.

Even when the only true name is the name that is written on a birth certificate, official documents often contain misspellings in the name, even death certificates. Death certificates often contain the name the person was known for or how they used to call themselves. I've seen hundreds of death certificates, and an alternate name or name spelling does NOT make the death certificate document less valid.

Whether his name was Joe or Joseph therefore is TOTALLY IRRELEVANT. If the name on his birthcertificate spells "Michael Joseph Jackson", than that is his legal name. However he may have abbreviated it later in life as "Joe" and used it on legal documents. For the same reason, his name may have appeared on the death certificate as "Michael Joe Jackson".

You simply CAN'T conclude that because the name on the death certificate is "Michael Joe Jackson" that it does not concern Michael!

Another thing to one of the posters above about the legality of hoaxing a death: when someone is under OFFICIAL protection they can LEGALLY obtain a new identity.

Thank you for sharing! I think it expalins everything!

[MJJ1982]

Whether his name was Joe or Joseph therefore is TOTALLY IRRELEVANT. If the name on his birthcertificate spells "Michael Joseph Jackson", than that is his legal name. However he may have abbreviated it later in life as "Joe" and used it on legal documents. For the same reason, his name may have appeared on the death certificate as "Michael Joe Jackson".

You simply CAN'T conclude that because the name on the death certificate is "Michael Joe Jackson" that it does not concern Michael!

He didn't change his name in later life into Joe, because that name is also on his Motown contract. At that time, he was too young to change his name.
And where's a dc with the name JOE on it? I haven't seen it...
For legal things (and when he was young) he used the name Joe. So that's why I think that he was born as Joe. In later life he decided to use another name for his other 'person', the business man. That's possible, because there are a lot of artists that use an other name in business than in their private life.

[Raven]

Whether his name was Joe or Joseph therefore is TOTALLY IRRELEVANT. If the name on his birthcertificate spells "Michael Joseph Jackson", than that is his legal name. However he may have abbreviated it later in life as "Joe" and used it on legal documents. For the same reason, his name may have appeared on the death certificate as "Michael Joe Jackson".

You simply CAN'T conclude that because the name on the death certificate is "Michael Joe Jackson" that it does not concern Michael!

He didn't change his name in later life into Joe, because that name is also on his Motown contract. At that time, he was too young to change his name.
And where's a dc with the name JOE on it? I haven't seen it...
For legal things (and when he was young) he used the name Joe. So that's why I think that he was born as Joe. In later life he decided to use another name for his other 'person', the business man. That's possible, because there are a lot of artists that use an other name in business than in their private life.

I did not state the name on the death certificate WAS "Michael Joe Jackson". I gave it as an example of how a name can be different on a death certificate or other legal documents from that on a birth certificate. You're getting into the "what was on the death certificate" and "what was on the birth certificate" again. You're missing the point I'm afraid.

[MJJ1982]

Whether his name was Joe or Joseph therefore is TOTALLY IRRELEVANT. If the name on his birthcertificate spells "Michael Joseph Jackson", than that is his legal name. However he may have abbreviated it later in life as "Joe" and used it on legal documents. For the same reason, his name may have appeared on the death certificate as "Michael Joe Jackson".

You simply CAN'T conclude that because the name on the death certificate is "Michael Joe Jackson" that it does not concern Michael!

He didn't change his name in later life into Joe, because that name is also on his Motown contract. At that time, he was too young to change his name.
And where's a dc with the name JOE on it? I haven't seen it...
For legal things (and when he was young) he used the name Joe. So that's why I think that he was born as Joe. In later life he decided to use another name for his other 'person', the business man. That's possible, because there are a lot of artists that use an other name in business than in their private life.

I did not state the name on the death certificate WAS "Michael Joe Jackson". I gave it as an example of how a name can be different on a death certificate or other legal documents from that on a birth certificate. You're getting into the "what was on the death certificate" and "what was on the birth certificate" again. You're missing the point I'm afraid.

I'm not missing the point, I do understand what you mean. But there's more than just this logic explanation.

[Hopeless]

I found this :
http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxdeath.net/ ... f=64&t=283

In his passports his name was Michael Joe Jackson.....it is so confused...i have not so much time to surch all the documents and make a list...

The driver licence ...also Michael Joe Jackson :
http://twitpic.com/upfnl

If he was identified at the UCLA with his drivers licence...why are they using the name Michael Joseph Jackson ?

Who is Michael Joseph Jackson ?

[Hopeless]

Wonder why his name on the death certificate is Michael Joseph Jackon and the name on the birth certificates from the kids is the father Michael Joseph...the Estate is the Estate from Michael Joseph Jackson.

In 2005 here was the photo from the Sheriffs Depart., only Michael Jackson....and the HGT was 511,
in the drivers licence from Michael Joe Jackson HGT was 509...i don't know this . Is there a great difference ?

http://img2.timeinc.net/people/i/2009/s ... kson-4.jpg

[Raven]

I found this :
http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxdeath.net/ ... f=64&t=283

In his passports his name was Michael Joe Jackson.....it is so confused...i have not so much time to surch all the documents and make a list...

The driver licence ...also Michael Joe Jackson :
http://twitpic.com/upfnl

If he was identified at the UCLA with his drivers licence...why are they using the name Michael Joseph Jackson ?

Who is Michael Joseph Jackson ?

THE DIFFERENCES DO NOT MATTER, please read my post above, it is not relevant!

The name on his birthcertificate, his legal name, may have been "Michael Joseph Jackson".

He may have used the name "Joe" whenever he pleased on other legal documents such as his driver licence, that is not uncommon. Joe is short for Joseph. Mike is short for Michael. If he used to call himself Mike, that would also be OK. The name on the death certificate may have been different from the driver's license because of LaToya, since she knows his true legal birth name. LaToya was the familymember that co-signed the death certificate.

[Hopeless]

I never saw a birth certificate from Michael Jackson....have you a link ?
Sorry i am german....here you must allways use the same name on official documents...
I don't know why the links from the copyright catalog are not working for long and why you see not what i see when i put the link in my post.
I find no logical way in all this.
Michael Jackson was born as Michael Joseph ? ok.
Why he use the name Michael Joe in the early years with the Jacksons in the copyright catalog ?
There are some songs registrated in the catalog that we all know from the Jacksons on the name Michael Joe.
Most of his songs, released or not dosn't matter are registrated on the name Michael Jackson.
And then...why he use the name Michael Joseph only for 20 songs in the years 1992-1994 ? These songs i never heard and the names from the ppl who are working with him...never heard.
The logical way was his name Joseph in the early years, because he was very young and used his birth name....why take it official for copyrights in the 90'th years ?
Is it rearly so unimportend to switch the names ?
Copyrights are very importend and the absolut correct name is very importend to get all the rights.
With love, Hopeless

[Hopeless]

I read in an other forum that Katherine Jackson write in her Biographie that he was born as Michael Joe Jackson....i can't proof it, but when it was right....she must know.
Has anybody the Biographie ?
When he was born as Michael Joe, i think he must also buried as Michael Joe ?

[Raven]

I never saw a birth certificate from Michael Jackson....have you a link ?
Sorry i am german....here you must allways use the same name on official documents...
I don't know why the links from the copyright catalog are not working for long and why you see not what i see when i put the link in my post.
I find no logical way in all this.
Michael Jackson was born as Michael Joseph ? ok.
Why he use the name Michael Joe in the early years with the Jacksons in the copyright catalog ?
There are some songs registrated in the catalog that we all know from the Jacksons on the name Michael Joe.
Most of his songs, released or not dosn't matter are registrated on the name Michael Jackson.
And then...why he use the name Michael Joseph only for 20 songs in the years 1992-1994 ? These songs i never heard and the names from the ppl who are working with him...never heard.
The logical way was his name Joseph in the early years, because he was very young and used his birth name....why take it official for copyrights in the 90'th years ?
Is it rearly so unimportend to switch the names ?
Copyrights are very importend and the absolut correct name is very importend to get all the rights.
With love, Hopeless

Yes ofcourse it would be ideal if there were no errors in documents. Especially in Germany they like it "punctlich", correct. However reality is, there are a lot of errors in documents, that's just how it is and it happens a lot.

How the errors happen? Some people may abbreviate their birth name because they don't like the full name. Or that is how their parents and family would call them. For instance Elisabeth would become Lisa, Michael would become Mike. Jan may fill in as his name Johannes because he thinks it is more 'chique' or 'official'. Then when they apply for a driver's license that is the name they will fill in as their name. Some people don't even know their own full birth name. This is/was especially the case when people could not read or write, which was often the case in the past. The clerc also may make an error in spelling of the name. Janet may be misspelled as Jaenet or Jaenette for instance. Also errors happen with dates or years.
This with the copyright thing, may have also been caused by someone else. If someone else registered for Michael, e.g. the secretary of the manager or a lawyer or what not, they may have filled in an incomplete or incorrect name. I have encountered this myself, when someone else did not fill in my full legal name since they were not aware of it or just sloppy and when I noticed it it was already finalised and too late to change. As a result, searching for this document with my full name is not successful.

Reality is, it happens a lot and it does not make a document less legal or valid.

[loveumj88]

i always and will always believe that Michael Joe Jackson is his REAL NAME, and Michael Joseph is just his celebrity name...

[MJJ1982]

I found this :
http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxdeath.net/ ... f=64&t=283

In his passports his name was Michael Joe Jackson.....it is so confused...i have not so much time to surch all the documents and make a list...

The driver licence ...also Michael Joe Jackson :
http://twitpic.com/upfnl

If he was identified at the UCLA with his drivers licence...why are they using the name Michael Joseph Jackson ?

Who is Michael Joseph Jackson ?

THE DIFFERENCES DO NOT MATTER, please read my post above, it is not relevant!

The name on his birthcertificate, his legal name, may have been "Michael Joseph Jackson".

He may have used the name "Joe" whenever he pleased on other legal documents such as his driver licence, that is not uncommon. Joe is short for Joseph. Mike is short for Michael. If he used to call himself Mike, that would also be OK. The name on the death certificate may have been different from the driver's license because of LaToya, since she knows his true legal birth name. LaToya was the familymember that co-signed the death certificate.

He did not only use the name Joe on documents, but also in court when he was under oath!

[Raven]

I found this :
http://www.michaeljacksonhoaxdeath.net/ ... f=64&t=283

In his passports his name was Michael Joe Jackson.....it is so confused...i have not so much time to surch all the documents and make a list...

The driver licence ...also Michael Joe Jackson :
http://twitpic.com/upfnl

If he was identified at the UCLA with his drivers licence...why are they using the name Michael Joseph Jackson ?

Who is Michael Joseph Jackson ?

THE DIFFERENCES DO NOT MATTER, please read my post above, it is not relevant!

The name on his birthcertificate, his legal name, may have been "Michael Joseph Jackson".

He may have used the name "Joe" whenever he pleased on other legal documents such as his driver licence, that is not uncommon. Joe is short for Joseph. Mike is short for Michael. If he used to call himself Mike, that would also be OK. The name on the death certificate may have been different from the driver's license because of LaToya, since she knows his true legal birth name. LaToya was the familymember that co-signed the death certificate.

He did not only use the name Joe on documents, but also in court when he was under oath!

So what you want to do about that? Sue him?
THE DIFFERENCES DO NOT MATTER

You're on a wild goose chase

[MJJ1982]

So what you want to do about that? Sue him?
THE DIFFERENCES DO NOT MATTER

You're on a wild goose chase

Why are you so convinced? If you are 100% convinced, then I'm sure that you can give us some proof.

[Raven]

So what you want to do about that? Sue him?
THE DIFFERENCES DO NOT MATTER

You're on a wild goose chase

Why are you so convinced? If you are 100% convinced, then I'm sure that you can give us some proof.

What sort of proof do you want? I have seen hundreds of death certificates and birthcertificates for that matter, I don't need to proof anything. This is the way these things go, this is reality. Don't want to believe it? Fine by me.

I'm ending this discussion, you just don't want to listen to reason.

[MJJ1982]

That you've seen hundreds of dc's and bc's, is no proof to me.
As far as I know, you are not allowed to use deteriorations in court.

Does anyone here know a lawyer in California? I've send an email to the court, but they didn't answer my question, they only said that I have to look through the 'help-topic's' on their website.

[Raven]

Little example of another alternative spelling

http://elvisdecoded.blogspot.com/2010/0 ... lling.html

[Kuki]

So what you want to do about that? Sue him?
THE DIFFERENCES DO NOT MATTER

You're on a wild goose chase

Why are you so convinced? If you are 100% convinced, then I'm sure that you can give us some proof.

What sort of proof do you want? I have seen hundreds of death certificates and birthcertificates for that matter, I don't need to proof anything. This is the way these things go, this is reality. Don't want to believe it? Fine by me.

I'm ending this discussion, you just don't want to listen to reason.

What do you mean with that, you have seen hunderds of dc/bc....so you're the expert? As far as I know, you are from the same country as I am, so explain yourself in Dutch. And then MAYBE we will listen to reason, right now I haven't read anything reasonable.

[Raven]

So what you want to do about that? Sue him?
THE DIFFERENCES DO NOT MATTER

You're on a wild goose chase

Why are you so convinced? If you are 100% convinced, then I'm sure that you can give us some proof.

What sort of proof do you want? I have seen hundreds of death certificates and birthcertificates for that matter, I don't need to proof anything. This is the way these things go, this is reality. Don't want to believe it? Fine by me.

I'm ending this discussion, you just don't want to listen to reason.

What do you mean with that, you have seen hunderds of dc/bc....so you're the expert? As far as I know, you are from the same country as I am, so explain yourself in Dutch. And then MAYBE we will listen to reason, right now I haven't read anything reasonable.

I've told my experience in here and what you want to do with the information I gave is totally up to you. Good luck.
Vertaling: als je mij voor leugenaar uit wilt maken zoek je het maar uit. Succes ermee.

[MJJ1982]

I agree with you Kuki!

[MJJ1982]

So what you want to do about that? Sue him?
THE DIFFERENCES DO NOT MATTER

You're on a wild goose chase

Why are you so convinced? If you are 100% convinced, then I'm sure that you can give us some proof.

What sort of proof do you want? I have seen hundreds of death certificates and birthcertificates for that matter, I don't need to proof anything. This is the way these things go, this is reality. Don't want to believe it? Fine by me.

I'm ending this discussion, you just don't want to listen to reason.

What do you mean with that, you have seen hunderds of dc/bc....so you're the expert? As far as I know, you are from the same country as I am, so explain yourself in Dutch. And then MAYBE we will listen to reason, right now I haven't read anything reasonable.

I've told my experience in here and what you want to do with the information I gave is totally up to you. Good luck.
Vertaling: als je mij voor leugenaar uit wilt maken zoek je het maar uit. Succes ermee.

Nobody is calling you a liar, but we are asking for PROOF and all you come up with, is your so called expierence and a blog that everyone could have written.

[Kuki]

I dont like it when people place words in my mouth I didn't say. I didn't say you are a liar, I said you have to convice me. Not by words, but with evidence!

[Raven]

So what you want to do about that? Sue him?
THE DIFFERENCES DO NOT MATTER

You're on a wild goose chase

Why are you so convinced? If you are 100% convinced, then I'm sure that you can give us some proof.

What sort of proof do you want? I have seen hundreds of death certificates and birthcertificates for that matter, I don't need to proof anything. This is the way these things go, this is reality. Don't want to believe it? Fine by me.

I'm ending this discussion, you just don't want to listen to reason.

What do you mean with that, you have seen hunderds of dc/bc....so you're the expert? As far as I know, you are from the same country as I am, so explain yourself in Dutch. And then MAYBE we will listen to reason, right now I haven't read anything reasonable.

I've told my experience in here and what you want to do with the information I gave is totally up to you. Good luck.
Vertaling: als je mij voor leugenaar uit wilt maken zoek je het maar uit. Succes ermee.

Nobody is calling you a liar, but we are asking for PROOF and all you come up with, is your so called expierence and a blog that everyone could have written.

"So called experience"??? Like I said, zoek het lekker uit.

[Kuki]

What's up with the attitude? I really dont get it. I asked you a simple question and this is what I get?

*ignore*

[MJJ1982]

You don't have to get rude.
Everyone here is looking for proof/evidence for the possible hoax, and the name-thing is important to figure out to the bottom.
So unless you come with real proof, I don't believe you.